President Donald Trump’s personal lawyer Rudy Giuliani tells ABC News that he is working as part of the president’s defense team in his upcoming second trial – and that he is prepared to argue that the president’s allegations of widespread voter fraud do not incite violence. because the -debunked claims are true.
“I’m involved now … I’m working on that,” Giuliani told correspondent Jonathan Karl, head of the White House.
A few hours later, Giuliani – who led the president’s efforts to reverse the 2020 election results – was spotted in the White House.
Giuliani’s involvement in Trump’s indictment comes because many of the attorneys involved in the president’s first indictment, including White House attorney Pat Cipollone and his deputies and outside attorneys Jay Sekulow and Jane and Marty Raskin, did not intends to return for the second trial.
During the January 6 rally, Giuliani spoke with Trump before the attack on the Capitol, where he urged the crowd to go on to “fight trial”. Five people, including a Capitol police officer, were killed when supporters of the Trump troop marched to the Capitol after the protest and entered the building in an attempt to deter members of Congress from holding presidential election for President-elect Joe Bid to certify.
According to Giuliani, there are “different opinions” on how the president should approach his second accusation.
The former New York mayor has said he will present, in defense of the president, allegations of widespread voter fraud that have been raised and rejected in dozens of courtrooms across the country.
‘They basically always claimed it [Trump] says voter fraud, voter fraud – whether I, or anyone else – incites us to violence; that these words are fighting words because they are completely untrue, “he said. Well, if you can prove it to be true, or at least true enough, so that it’s a legitimate point of view, then they are not fighting words anymore. “
He also said he personally believes Trump should move to reject the trial directly.
“If they decide to bring it to a trial, he must dismiss the accusation as completely illegal. That it was the only accusation made in two days, three days,” Giuliani told ABC News. “We would say to the court, ‘You allow it now in the future, basically in two days, Congress can just put forward anything they want.’
In a historic move last week, the House of Representatives voted to accuse Trump, while all Democrats along with ten Republican members voted to accuse the president of inciting supporters to storm the U.S. capital.
“The president of the United States has incited this uprising, this armed rebellion, against our common country. He must go,” Nancy Pelosi, D-California, said on the floor of the house. “He is a clear and present danger to the nation we all love.”
Rep. Liz Cheney, Republican Republic no. 3, was among the ten Republicans who voted to run for president. Cheney issued a scathing statement condemning the president’s actions before the vote, writing: ‘The President of the United States has summoned this crowd, gathered the crowd and lit the flame of this attack. without the president. ‘
Giuliani denied the validity of the single article of indictment, accusing Trump of inciting violence against the government on the grounds that the president’s protest did not incite the riot because there was a delay between the speech and the attack was.
“Basically, if [incitement] is going to happen, it has to happen right away, “he said. You have to make people run out, you have to get people running out of the frozen speech, all the way to the Capitol. And it’s basically incitement, ‘Giuliani said.
If the attempt to dismiss the indictment fails, it is likely, Giuliani said he would not rule out the president testifying. Trump’s lawyers were opposed to testifying during his first indictment, but Giuliani says the situation is different and the indictment is “much more straightforward.”
“You always make the decision at the last minute,” Giuliani said. “As a lawyer, I would not be as strongly opposed to the evidence as I was at the time.”
Sources close to the president recently told ABC News that Trump was increasingly irritated with Giuliani and that he did not take his calls, but he now appears to be very involved in the discussions on how to handle the indictment.
One of the remaining big questions about Trump’s last days in office is what apology he may issue and whether he will try to forgive himself, something Trump has told advisers he wants to do, even though no president has ever done so. White House Councilman Pat Cipollone has rejected Trump’s apology, in part because he does not think such a pardon will remain in court, according to sources familiar with the talks.
Giuliani did not want to say what advice he gave the president to forgive himself, but he told ABC News that his personal opinion is that it is completely justified.
“I think any lawyer should tell you there is nothing in the Constitution that allows it. There is nothing in the Constitution that forbids it. The clear language of the Constitution does not limit who we can forgive,” Giuliani said. “Do I think there is justification for it because of the atmosphere we are in? Practical justification? Absolutely.”
Giuliani dismissed the concerns of some Trump advisers that a self-forgiving attitude would make Trump more vulnerable to future civil litigation because it would be seen as an admission of guilt.
“I mean his legal life will be complicated no matter what,” Giuliani told ABC News. “Maybe because I’m more of a criminal lawyer than a civil lawyer, I want to make my civil life more complicated than my criminal life.”